508) When Interspecies Cry

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508) When Interspecies Cry

Postby Andrew » Sun Feb 09, 2020 10:36 am

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It has been some time since the hosts have looked into the news of Anime. Nearly a month and a half! Listen in and get their catch-up of the news and their perspective on the happenings around the industry.

Topics this episode: Funimation drops Interspecies Reviewers, Netflix New Shows, New Higurashi When They Cry, Trigger’s BNA, Satoshi Kon Series Releases, and much more!

Thanks to Lilblu96 and QuestRam for the great questions featured in this episode!

The opening music for this episode is the OP for Higurashi When They Cry called “Higurashi no Naku Koro ni” by Eiko Shimamiya. The closing music for this episode is the OP for Log Horizon called “database feat. TAKUMA (10 Feet)” by MAN WITH A MISSION.

We hope you all enjoy!
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Re: 508) When Interspecies Cry

Postby SethAmaha » Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:26 pm

I guess what I am worried about the whole Interspecies Reviewers is, will this cause a chill effect in the industry? Over the last couple of years, we have been getting more mature and risque titles coming our way. Production Committees and studios have been able to push the envelope bit by bit without too many problems but now they have found that there is a limit. In the business standpoint of the industry, is it worth taking on more risque tiles? Take for example the LN title, JK Haru is a Sex Worker in Another World. That premise alone is super risque but also incredibly intriguing. How will the story handle the situation At best, we might get it translated. But with the experience the industry now has, would anyone ever dare touch it? Would shows like Kuzu no Honkai or Domestic Girlfriend have a shot now if they didn't already have a first season?

There is very little that can be done to cancel shows that have already been planned for both Spring and Summer. But, come Fall, how many mature titles will we see? Will this experience affect the industry and make it so that we have seasons full of "safe" shows or will it be business as usual? What are your thoughts on this?

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Re: 508) When Interspecies Cry

Postby Eira » Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:54 pm

SethAmaha wrote:There is very little that can be done to cancel shows that have already been planned for both Spring and Summer. But, come Fall, how many mature titles will we see? Will this experience affect the industry and make it so that we have seasons full of "safe" shows or will it be business as usual? What are your thoughts on this?

It will be business as usual, have you seen uncensored interspecies, it's porn, like no ifs, ands, or buts about it, it's porn, 100% hentai all the way. It also just happened to be able to get a broadcast, most hentai isn't able to get what Interspecies got and so this is more of an extreme case more than anything.

Besides people who like to do more hard R shows always have the internet to go to and put there stuff up on netflix, like with devil man crybaby. I seriously doubt anything will change because of this, I think you're overeating.
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Re: 508) When Interspecies Cry

Postby BlueSpark » Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:56 am

OK, my take on the Interspecies Reviewers situation: From what I've gathered from the discussions on Reddit, the manga is much, much tamer than the anime adaptation. The majority opinion in the AnimeDubs community seems to be that Funimation simply didn't predict the show would turn into a full-blown hentai. Once they realized what they had gotten themselves into, they had no choice but to pull the plug.

Andrew, you're saying the synopsis paints a pretty clear picture. But when it comes to animes, that doesn't really mean that much. An outrageous premise could turn out to be a fun and wholesome show or vice-versa. Remember the first scene in A Sister's All You Need? That turned out to be infinitely more uncomfortable than expected. On the flipside, what about Yamada's First Time? Sounds like a hentai synopsis if I've ever read one. Susprise: The show is actually pretty sweet and innocent, just garnished with some raunchy humor.

I'm siding with Funimation on this one (Call me a fanboy or whatever, but this is my honest opinion). I mean, is it even legal to stream animated porn on a website without an age restriction system? And even if it is, I can clearly see why it'd be a moral dilemma. It's just not the type of content they want to stand for, which, again, they didn't realize until a few episodes in. This also comes with the territory of simulcasting/simuldubbing - you never know what's going to happen later on in a show.

An interesting comment I've seen a few times on Reddit said that "Interspecies Reviewers is now officially too spicy for Japan." I just checked for myself, and what do you know, a Japanese broadcasting station has pulled the show from their programme, too. So yeah, if anyone blames Funimation for this, make sure you're not falling into a double standard, because Japan did the same thing.

Now, hearing you say that AnimeLab will be continuing the show surprised me. Since they're working with Funimation, who decided not to host the show on their service anymore, I wonder if they'll continue producing the dub or if AnimeLab will only stream the subbed version.
If the dub is produced in full, I'm really torn on whether I want to look into the series. I don't mind large amounts of censorship for a title like this; in fact, it'd probably be more easily digestable this way. But from all I've gathered so far (I haven't looked at any actual footage), it sounds like this is still straddling the line of what I'd be comfortable with watching.

SethAmaha wrote:Would shows like Kuzu no Honkai or Domestic Girlfriend have a shot now if they didn't already have a first season?
I see what you're getting at, but as Eira hinted at, these two series are still worlds away from what IR did. There are sex scenes in them, but they're few and far between and don't show any genitals. In fact, I'm pretty sure Scum's Wish shows fewer naked breasts than your average ecchi anime.


I heard about a new When They Cry project coming. Personally, I'm more interested in a different development regarding the franchise: The 2nd season and the OVAs, which have unfortunately never been localized in English, are currently releasing in Germany. So in probably 1 or 2 months' time, I'll finally be able to watch the full series :) (On this note, thanks for not completely spoiling the twist). After that, I can turn my attention to whatever new thing is coming.


Lastly, regarding the question of supporting the industry without buying merch: I can see where Andrew is coming from, but I think the topic is much more nuanced. Personally, I go out of my way to buy American blu-ray releases (which I have to import to Europe) because my priority is supporting the dubbing companies. Since I'm a dub purist, without them, anime may as well be dead to me. I love their work and want them to continue it for as long as possible.

Furthermore, saying that funneling money to Japan directly will make the anime scene thrive seems a bit short-sighted to me: Yes, Japan will have more resources at their disposal to produce stuff. But if American companies like Funimation and Crunchyroll didn't make enough cash, they'd eventually have to reduce the number of series they license, wouldn't they? So even disregarding the matter of dubs, I think supporting the licensors is important so they can keep bringing stuff over to the west.
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Re: 508) When Interspecies Cry

Postby Ukkihsog » Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:09 am

To tell you the truth Higurashi was first horror i tasted in anime. The knife scene(knife and a wall) for some reason made me laugh so gao hard ::dread::
But what i liked the most is that after all horror parts ended. They added simple cute ova's it was so good it was like heavy weight was lifted after long series i wouldnt have enjoyed it as much if i hadnt watched the horror parts.
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Re: 508) When Interspecies Cry

Postby Eira » Tue Feb 11, 2020 1:59 pm

BlueSpark wrote:Once they realized what they had gotten themselves into, they had no choice but to pull the plug. [...] I'm siding with Funimation on this one (Call me a fanboy or whatever, but this is my honest opinion). I mean, is it even legal to stream animated porn on a website without an age restriction system? And even if it is, I can clearly see why it'd be a moral dilemma. It's just not the type of content they want to stand for, which, again, they didn't realize until a few episodes in.

I still think someone in quality control messed up. I also do find it surprising they they completely translated, organised people and dubbed the whole first episode and then put it out despite the voice actors saying it made them uncomfortable and then pulling the plug. It just seems really weird that even as it was ramping up and staff begun to show concern they still decided to put the dub out. PLUS funimation was showing the censored version anyway and only the uncensored version is the really really bad stuff, obviously.

However it is perfectly fine to show "porn" on a site without an age restriction since I don't even know any porn sites that do that. You can usually watch stuff without an account and if you do need one you can lie about the age easily, there's never a high bar to clear. Also TV doesn't have any age restrictions built into it normally so when it was broadcasting you could see it as long as no other people stopped you. As long as the rating is listed and it details why that rating is given then the company has satisfactory informed the viewer of what the content is about.

Also I do find it interesting that Funimation dropped it, Wakanim said they'd dropped it but then only dropped it in the Nordic Countries and not in France, Germany, or Russia. And then AnimeLab in Australia is still keeping it and has become the ones to source it now. All 3 are owned by Sony and according to Sony they're all the same company in the back end so this is interesting.

Also I can understand if you're saying you agree with why Funimation did it but I really hope you're not saying you're glad that the content is gone, I personally think all content should be easy to legally get for all people and funimation grabbing up the rights while it matters only to end up blocking it off is absurd, even the rights go back up now the timing is all off and others might not be interested. I'm just glad Madman and Wakanim either pushed back or didn't face any pressure from Sony and thus are allowed to keep showing it. It's not like anyone is forced to watch it just cause a site they use has it.
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Re: 508) When Interspecies Cry

Postby BlueSpark » Wed Feb 12, 2020 2:52 am

Eira wrote:despite the voice actors saying it made them uncomfortable
I haven't specifically looked into any staff members' statements on the series, so maybe you have a point. I just read one message from Brittany Lauda that said several things, but basically, while it wasn't the type of content she particularly enjoyed voice-acting in, she was OK with it, and at the end of the day, it was part of the job that pays her expenses. Just throwing it out there - perhaps you're right and the majority of VAs thought differently about it.

Eira wrote:PLUS funimation was showing the censored version anyway and only the uncensored version is the really really bad stuff, obviously.
I don't think this makes a meaningful difference - porn is still porn, whether you censor it or not. If someone isn't comfortable with watching (or, in this case, hosting) porn in general, I doubt a few censor bars will change their mind.

Eira wrote:However it is perfectly fine to show "porn" on a site without an age restriction since I don't even know any porn sites that do that. You can usually watch stuff without an account and if you do need one you can lie about the age easily, there's never a high bar to clear. Also TV doesn't have any age restrictions built into it normally so when it was broadcasting you could see it as long as no other people stopped you. As long as the rating is listed and it details why that rating is given then the company has satisfactory informed the viewer of what the content is about.
Thanks for the reply, makes sense for the most part. Yeah, I was thinking of the "Are you 18 or older?" question, which has never stopped anybody, but at least serves as a minimum (legal and moral) safeguard for the party hosting the content. Regarding TV broadcasts, I think they usually circumvent the issue by only showing mature content during the night hours, right? At least that's how it works in Germany.

Eira wrote:I really hope you're not saying you're glad that the content is gone
Well, yes and no. Perrsonally, I don't care one way or the other as I don't check out incomplete shows (or rather seasons). I do empathize with fans who want to experience the show, even if Funimation has only produced a small part of it. On the other hand, I think Funimation has a right to decide what they want to host on their site and what they don't. It's about their reputation. I think that should take precedence over making the show available to the fandom at any cost.
I do hope they're open to selling the license to another company who doesn't mind putting it out. And if by that point, anime fans aren't willing to accept a couple of weeks' worth of a delay... Well, then frankly, I don't think they were seriously interested in the show in the first place.
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Re: 508) When Interspecies Cry

Postby Eira » Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:00 am

BlueSpark wrote:
Eira wrote:despite the voice actors saying it made them uncomfortable
I haven't specifically looked into any staff members' statements on the series, so maybe you have a point. [...] perhaps you're right and the majority of VAs thought differently about it.

I could also be the one who's wrong, maybe I misunderstood something or made it more of a deal in my mind then they meant, either way I just think considering the situation it's weird that the entire dub process happened for an episode and went up only for it to be dropped very shortly after.

Eira wrote:PLUS funimation was showing the censored version anyway and only the uncensored version is the really really bad stuff, obviously.
I don't think this makes a meaningful difference - porn is still porn, whether you censor it or not. If someone isn't comfortable with watching (or, in this case, hosting) porn in general, I doubt a few censor bars will change their mind.[/quote]
I think it can change minds if it's small enough in the first place but this show is extreme enough that I guess it doesn't matter, I still think it's worth bringing up and keeping in mind tho.

BlueSpark wrote:
Eira wrote:TV doesn't have any age restrictions built into it normally so when it was broadcasting you could see it as long as no other people stopped you.
Regarding TV broadcasts, I think they usually circumvent the issue by only showing mature content during the night hours, right? At least that's how it works in Germany.

True, but for japan that's a bit of a weird case because pretty much all anime airs late anyway, if you go through MAL and look at air times most air during any time from 11PM - 3AM most of the time. Also I was just saying that just like online, it's not easy to get around since again, there's no age restriction. This is why I also said 'as long as no other people stop you'. I can remember when I was young staying up at my friends house and then we'd turn on the TV later at night to try and catch those kind of programs secretly, just like with the internet nothing really stops you, but this is pretty much unrelated at this point.

BlueSpark wrote:
Eira wrote:I really hope you're not saying you're glad that the content is gone
Well, yes and no. Personally, I don't care one way or the other as I don't check out incomplete shows (or rather seasons). I do empathize with fans who want to experience the show, even if Funimation has only produced a small part of it. On the other hand, I think Funimation has a right to decide what they want to host on their site and what they don't. It's about their reputation. I think that should take precedence over making the show available to the fandom at any cost.

I more so meant the content being gone completely, at least in legal terms within the Americas. In funimation doesn't want the show I don't care but I'm saying I'd rather they just never took the rights at all if this is the result. I'm asking I hope you're not okay with the content being gone completely not gone from funimation specifically. (Again ignoring illegal means and specifically talking about in america) Everyone should legally be allowed to access media and the owners of the show should have the right to show it legally and make money off of it in america.

BlueSpark wrote:I do hope they're open to selling the license to another company who doesn't mind putting it out. And if by that point, anime fans aren't willing to accept a couple of weeks' worth of a delay... Well, then frankly, I don't think they were seriously interested in the show in the first place.

I feel like Funimation will HAVE to give up the rights, in which case the orginally owners in japan are who will be selling it again. Since I assume any contract like this would specify that the owners put out all the content by specific times and also funimation contracts probably say they have to make the dub too, so I imagine they will have to forfiet the rights by dropping it.

However it's not the anime fans not wanting to wait that I'm worried about, it's the other companies. I highly doubt they'll break there usually schedule to find some time to grab a show that's already begun airing. Now if crunchyroll of hidive want to go back and grab it that'd be great, but I don't think they're going to and so by funimation temporarily taking away the rights and then giving them up later it's very likely anyone in america who's a legal watcher may have to miss out. And I know Chris and Andrew are legal watchers so maybe we won't see inter species reviewers in the season review now.
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Re: 508) When Interspecies Cry

Postby BlueSpark » Thu Feb 13, 2020 2:48 am

Eira wrote:In funimation doesn't want the show I don't care but I'm saying I'd rather they just never took the rights at all if this is the result.
Well, as I outlined before, it's highly likely they simply didn't have an accurate grasp of what the anime would entail (again, going back to the misleading source material and the nature of simuldubbing). Surely they didn't buy the license just to record 1 episode and then cancel the show. It's an unfortunate development, but I can't blame Funimation for it. Of course, in hindsight, everyone wishes that Funi had decided not to buy this license, but hindsight is 20/20.

Eira wrote:I'm asking I hope you're not okay with the content being gone completely not gone from funimation specifically.
This I can certainly agree with. Ideally, the series would be made available to all fans who want to see it, no matter how debatable the content is.

Eira wrote:I assume any contract like this would specify that the owners put out all the content by specific times and also funimation contracts probably say they have to make the dub too
I wonder. I honestly have no idea whether licensing companies are contractually obligated to put out content. I'd assume the Japanese studio receives their payment up-front in the form of the licensing fee, so from a business standpoint, they shouldn't care whether the anime is actually made available to the American audience. So if such an obligation exists, I reckon it's more about the Japanese wanting their work to be seen (out of a sense of pride or passion for their work), not about receiving money for it.

Eira wrote:Now if crunchyroll of hidive want to go back and grab it that'd be great, but I don't think they're going to
Well, HiDive at least frequently releases their dubbed shows in 3-episode batches or in full shortly after the show has finished airing (kind of like Netflix), so this would still very much fit their broadcast model.
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Re: 508) When Interspecies Cry

Postby Eira » Sat Feb 15, 2020 1:35 am

BlueSpark wrote:
Eira wrote:In funimation doesn't want the show I don't care but I'm saying I'd rather they just never took the rights at all if this is the result.
Of course, in hindsight, everyone wishes that Funi had decided not to buy this license, but hindsight is 20/20.

Well yer, that's obviously what I meant. I'm not really blaming anyone with that statement in particular. I'm just saying looking back, it would best if they hadn't got it.

Eira wrote:I assume any contract like this would specify that the owners put out all the content by specific times and also funimation contracts probably say they have to make the dub too
I wonder. I honestly have no idea whether licensing companies are contractually obligated to put out content. I'd assume the Japanese studio receives their payment up-front in the form of the licensing fee, so from a business standpoint, they shouldn't care whether the anime is actually made available to the American audience. So if such an obligation exists, I reckon it's more about the Japanese wanting their work to be seen (out of a sense of pride or passion for their work), not about receiving money for it.[/quote]
Well I'm not sure how Funimation does it but we know how the crunchyroll model works and depending on how much a show is watched that is more money for people back in japan, it's not JUST an upfront cost. It's the upfront cost and then more, depending on who watches it and how they watch it.

If it's a free user they see about 5-ish ads per episode, it might be more I really can't remember since it's been ages since I was a free member but basically crunchyroll will already have the money to run that ad and send half of what each ad is worth to the company that made the show each time that ad is watched by someone in relation to the show, so it's half the ad revenue basically. Secondly if it's a premium member then each month half the subscription goes to CR and the other half is then divided up to the different companies based on what you watched that month. So the more variety in what the watch the less each company will get, but if you only watch show they'll get half of your entire sub payment.

Now maybe funimation does it different, I don't know. But we know for sure that's how CR does it. So while the initial payment is nice I would want the show to keep being put out for the continued stream of income. Plus as you've used as justification before, buying merch and extra stuff like that would only happen from fans and if there are people who can't watch your show in some countries legally because a company took the rights and did nothing with it, well then you're going to miss out of potential fans. If I was the creator of something and a company wanted to take it somewhere else, I'd have the contract say they'd have to at least be putting it out.

Eira wrote:Now if crunchyroll of hidive want to go back and grab it that'd be great, but I don't think they're going to
Well, HiDive at least frequently releases their dubbed shows in 3-episode batches or in full shortly after the show has finished airing (kind of like Netflix), so this would still very much fit their broadcast model.[/quote]
Well sure but they put the show in japanese out weekly and even if they dub that way, then also just like netflix they'd also be getting the rights and sorting out the dub before the show comes out like normal. It's not out the cards that they would get the right tho, and like I said, I'd love if they did. I just really doubt it.
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